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Minutes of 8/31/2017 APPROVED

September 18th, 2017

Town of Carroll Building Committee Meeting Minutes
August 31, 2017 @ 9:00 a.m.
Carroll Town Hall

Members present: Tadd Bailey, Allan Clark, Mike Finn, John Gardiner, Brad Houston, Jeremy Oleson, Terry Penner, David Scalley, Peter Stewart, Imre Szauter, and John Trammell. Guests present: Bobbi Amirault, Wayne Garneau, Ben Jellison, Joanne Lydon, Mike Rouillard, and Rena Vecchio.

The Building Committee (the “Committee”) meeting began at 9:03 a.m. and was recorded.

Attendees stood and recited the Pledge of Allegiance.

An agenda was distributed and a sign-in sheet was routed around.

Attendees introduced themselves.

The Aug. 17th draft meeting minutes were discussed. John Gardiner made a motion, seconded by Terry Penner, to approve the minutes as written. The vote in favor was unanimous.

Allan Clark opened a discussion on an Aug. 24th meeting with the NH DOT District One engineer responsible for driveway permits. Allan Clark described the location of the proposed driveway intersection with US 302, and recalled the NH DOT engineer’s opinion that the proposed driveway would be far superior to the current School Street intersection with US 302. Based on the feedback from the NH DOT engineer, Allan Clark does not anticipate any issues with the new driveway. The formal driveway permit application will require engineering drawings, which will be completed in Phase Two.

Allan Clark reminded attendees that the conceptual drawings, floor plans and elevations that were posted on the Google Drive and distributed in hardcopy format at the meeting are part of the process to prepare a project informational package to be presented at town deliberative session and placed before the voters in 2018. The drawings do not represent exactly what will be built. The goal is to update conceptual drawings, floor plans and elevations before the next Committee meeting, based on input from today’s meeting and additional feedback from employees and the public. Allan Clark will prepare the project budget and have the package ready for the Sep. 28th informational session.

If Phase Two is approved by the voters, all drawings and information developed in Phase One will be delivered to a construction manager and an architect who will follow the design-build model for completion of the project.

Regarding the floor plans, Allan Clark encouraged attendees to focus on higher-level issues such as room size, storage space, room adjacencies, and traffic flow, not the details that will be addressed in actual construction drawings during Phase Two.

Rena Vecchio asked about the current Town Hall parcel size. Imre Szauter stated the parcel is 0.87 acres. Allan Clark said that once the section of School Street between the new driveway and US 302 is removed, that portion of land should be added to the Town Hall parcel, increasing its size.

Peter Stewart opened a discussion on the conceptual drawing. He described the layout of the campus and the driveway, the parking areas and how vehicle and pedestrian traffic would flow, the proposed rerouting of the snow mobile trail, and how the campus would be graded.

John Gardiner asked about the snow mobile trail and whether any of the asphalt between the new driveway and US 302 (west end of School Street) would be preserved. Allan Clark suggested that entire section of asphalt should be removed, the area regraded, and the snow mobile trail be brought to US 302 as shown on the conceptual drawing. Wayne Garneau asked how a possible sale of the existing Town Hall to a private entity would affect the snow mobile trail. Allan Clark stated that easements could be placed on the property to ensure snow mobile trail access.

John Gardiner asked if the septic system as shown on the conceptual drawing would service the entire campus. Allan Clark stated that he anticipates a septic system in that area would serve the entire campus and would likely allow a gravity system to be installed.

Wayne Garneau stated that the proposal would force all vehicle traffic to access the information booth using the driveway from US 3 and asked if any improvements were planned for that intersection. Allan Clark responded that none were planned for that intersection in this project.

With no additional comments or questions on the conceptual drawing, Peter Stewart opened a discussion on the floor plans, starting with the public safety building. He conducted a walk-through of the fire department portion of the building, describing each space and its function. Allan Clark asked if there were any questions or comments on the fire department floor plan.

Mike Finn asked if any portion of the building had a basement. Allan Clark responded that the entire project would be built slab-on-grade. Mike Finn also asked if the admin area in the fire department would be staffed. Allan Clark replied that there would be no personnel performing a reception function in that area. Jeremy Oleson stated that someone arriving at the fire department with an emergency should first call 911 or use the exterior call box near the fire department lobby (admin) door. He also stated that the admin area would be used for issuing fire permits and providing other non-emergency services.

Wayne Garneau asked where the fire department would hold meetings and training. Allan Clark replied the area marked “EOC” (Emergency Operations Center) doubles as the fire department meeting and training room.

Ben Jellison asked if Allan Clark would compare the proposed apparatus bay size with the current fire department apparatus bay. Allan Clark stated the proposed apparatus bay was significantly larger to provide for both current and future fire department vehicles. He also offered that the double-loading design provides more flexibility, especially when the town acquires a larger vehicle such as a ladder truck.

John Gardiner reminded attendees that the town should be building for the future, especially with anticipated new development out east at Bretton Woods.

Bobbi Amirault asked if the new fire department design could still accommodate the pancake breakfasts and if so, would the dirty gear area have any impact on the kitchen. Allan Clark stated that the dirty gear area is not for storage of soiled materials, it is for personnel returning from an emergency to safely remove and clean their soiled clothing and firefighting gear using a washer and dryer in the space, and decontaminate themselves using the shower. Jeremy Oleson mentioned that there would be plenty of room in the north apparatus bay near the kitchen for future pancake breakfasts.

Hearing no additional questions on the fire department floor plan, Peter Stewart opened a discussion on the police department floor plan. He conducted a walk-through of the police department portion of the building, describing each space and its function. Allan Clark asked if there were any questions or comments on the police department floor plan.

John Trammell stated that he and Tadd Bailey calculated the amount of space used for current police department records and they would like to meet with Peter Stewart and Allan Clark after the Committee meeting to discuss increasing the records storage space in the floor plan.

Terry Penner asked if it was possible to use space above the police department for records storage. John Trammell noted that the ADA (Americans with Disabilities Act) would likely require an elevator if records were stored above the main floor, significantly increasing the project’s cost.

John Trammell stated that in addition to records storage space, some of the room sizes shown on the floor plan are too small. He mentioned that room adjacencies looked fine.

Kelly Trammell mentioned she received a reply from the New Hampshire Municipal Association (NHMA) regarding her question on municipal records retention. She will share the reply with the Committee.

Ben Jellison asked how changes to the conceptual drawing, floor plans and elevations would be communicated back to the Committee before the informational session on Sep. 28th. Allan Clark said changes would be made quickly by Peter Stewart and updated drawings brought to the next meeting. Imre Szauter stated that there will likely be two additional Committee meetings (Sep. 14th and the morning of Sep. 28th) prior to the informational session, if approved by the Committee.

Hearing no additional questions or comments on the police department floor plan, Peter Stewart opened a discussion on the Town Hall floor plan. He conducted a walk-through of the Town Hall, describing each space and its function. Imre Szauter asked if there were any questions or comments on the Town Hall floor plan.

Kelly Trammel suggested moving the library and historical society space closer to the community room, as access to the library as shown requires the main portion of the Town Hall to be open. She stated moving the library and historical society room would put it closer to the large west public parking lot and when open on Saturdays, allow the main portion of Town Hall to be locked.

Kelly Trammell suggested some additional changes to the size and location of several offices, based on current roles and personnel changes that may take place in the future. She addressed the secure storage area, noting that the Town Clerk is required to secure such items as voting machines, license plates and stickers. Kelly Trammell also mentioned that most of the records in the basement and on the second floor of Town Hall should be placed in secure storage, a space that offers additional fire and water protection.

Further discussion took place on what constitutes “secure” storage and what records are required to have a higher level of protection.

Allan Clark reiterated that design considerations should focus on job functions, not individual employees.

Becki Pederson commented that the town clerk’s office is shown across the hall from the secure storage area, requiring the town clerk to exit her office to access materials needed for her job function. By relocating the employee restroom and replacing it with a small secure storage area accessible only to the town clerk, this situation could be eliminated.

Rena Vecchio mentioned that planning and zoning activities have increased and will likely generate more visitor traffic to Town Hall. Therefore, careful thought should be put into the size and placement of the planning office and its proximity to the conference room. She stated that she foresees the planning and zoning secretary becoming the building inspector’s secretary at some point, creating a need for more space in the planning office for the building inspector.

Bobbi Amirault asked if a library entrance could be placed in the back (on the north wall) to provide access when the Town Hall is closed. John Gardiner stated that a separate library entrance would address the Town Hall security issue, but would also require a separate restroom facility within the library.

Imre Szauter asked if there were any additional questions or comments on the Town Hall floor plan. He asked attendees if the flow of the Town Hall worked for them, keeping in mind some of the changes requested today. He also asked if the community room as shown would provide the necessary space to host activities authorized by the Select Board.

Kelly Trammell asked if the community room west wall doors would be designed for everyday use or as emergency exits. Allan Clark stated that he envisions community room traffic using the lobby entrance and the hallway doors to access the community room, in part to maintain energy efficiency.

Allan Clark addressed the planning office size. Kelly Trammell stated that she feels the space is too small if the building inspector uses the planning office. Rena Vecchio suggested moving the kitchen to another location and connecting the planning office with the conference room.

Peter Stewart summarized his understanding of the suggested changes and sought clarification on several issues.

Imre Szauter addressed the issue of records that must be stored in fire- and water-resistant type storage versus general storage. Both storage areas would be secured by lock & key or keycard access. Storing records in a vault-like space is more expensive than general storage, so all town paper records should be reviewed to determine which must be kept in paper format. Additionally, disposal of some records (either before or after scanning into PDF/A (Portable Document Format/Archive)) would reduce required storage space and increase record retrieval efficiency.

Mike Finn asked how often records must be retrieved in response to litigation. Kelly Trammell answered that there is a legal action currently underway that requires access to many documents, a time-consuming process without an efficient retrieval system. Further, New Hampshire right-to-know laws require that the town make most records available to the public on demand.

Allan Clark summarized storage as either general or vault-like, both under lock & key. Kelly Trammell asked for clarification on which documents would require vault-like storage versus general storage, to which Allan Clark replied that the town should review New Hampshire RSA 33-A (Revised Statutes Annotated) for guidance and work with the Select Board and the municipal records committee to implement a compliant policy.

Rena Vecchio asked if Committee members had walked through the Town Hall second floor and basement record storage areas to get a sense of the volume of records kept by the town. Imre Szauter acknowledged the volume of records in storage and stated that continued storage of some records may be unnecessary either before or after being scanned and stored electronically. Rena Vecchio also pointed out that while some records need not be kept to meet legal requirements, there may be some with historical significance.

Terry Penner asked how much of the floor plan space requires direct public access. Imre Szauter offered that discussions with current staff indicate town clerk, administrative assistant and finance clerk, in that order, are most frequently interacting with the public. Further, those functions lend themselves well to a two-level counter arrangement with public access from a hallway, which provides a level of separation and security. He stated that planning, zoning and building inspector functions are less frequently accessed by the public, but that will likely change in the future. Relocating the planning office and adding direct access to the conference room could enhance public access to those functions.

Terry Penner suggested that placing the three higher-traffic functions (town clerk, administration and finance) near the lobby area and the lesser-traffic functions (planning, zoning and building inspection) further away might improve public access and flow within Town Hall.

Ben Jellison asked about connectivity between the town clerk, administrative, and finance offices. Becki Pederson stated that the town clerk requires access to the tax cards, currently stored in the administrative office area. Accessing the administrative office or the secure storage area without going into the public hallway enhances security and efficiency. Kelly Trammell described finance clerk interactions with the town clerk and the administrative assistant, and how adjacent offices and internal access benefits everyone.

Tadd Bailey stated he and John Trammell calculated that their suggested changes to the police department floor plan would likely not increase the size of that portion of the public safety building.

Bobbi Amirault asked if the library were to be relocated, would its size be impacted by the need for a separate entrance and/or restroom. Imre Szauter suggested that Peter Stewart would be able to determine that once the new location was chosen.

With no further questions or comments on the floor plans, Allan Clark opened a discussion on project manager issues. He stated that he didn’t have an updated budget analysis, since the only change in expenditures has been the project manager’s fee. Allan Clark stated that he is still working on the existing building analysis. He will have both documents ready for the next public meeting.

Allan Clark asked for feedback on the process, Committee expectations, and his project management role. Rena Vecchio stated she felt the Committee was doing a good job. Kelly Trammell indicated she has heard misinformation about the status of the current buildings and the timing of this project. Imre Szauter noted that the Committee decided at the last meeting to conduct a mailing to all town property owners before the Sep. 28th informational session, in the hopes of increasing attendance at that informational session and placing facts in the hands of the public who cannot or choose not to attend.

To help get information out to the public, Ben Jellison suggested contacting Tara Giles at the Coos County Democrat to invite her to the Sep. 28th informational session and/or offer to write a press release for publication. Imre Szauter replied that at the Committee’s request, in June he emailed a press release to Tara Giles for consideration but never received a reply.

Allan Clark complimented the guests for attending the meeting, encouraged them to share what they’ve learned, and continue to offer suggestions on making this a successful project. He stressed the ongoing need to expand the Committee to include more residents in the process.

Imre Szauter stated that Greg Hogan reported at the Aug. 28th Select Board meeting that the hydrant testing by EJP, Inc. would be rescheduled for the week of Sep. 4th.

Wayne Garneau asked if the Town Hall community room would be limited to certain functions if it did not have a sprinkler system installed. Allan Clark replied that a place of assembly rated for 300 occupants or less need not have a sprinkler system. If the place of assembly is used for a dance hall, disco, or nightclub, that number drops to 100. Jeremy Oleson stated that equipping the community room with a sprinkler system is a worthwhile consideration.

Imre Szauter opened a discussion on the draft letter announcing the Sep 28th informational session. He asked attendees to review the draft letter distributed with the agenda.

Imre Szauter provided cost estimates from two sources to conduct the mailing to all property owners in the Town of Carroll. Staples could print and fold the two-sided letter; taping the letter and postage metering would require Committee member work. Mailings Unlimited, the company used by the town clerk to process property tax invoices, could print, fold, and insert the letter into a windowed business #10 envelope and affix the proper presorted-rate first class postage. The cost estimates were within a few dollars of each other.

Jeremy Oleson made a motion, seconded by Tadd Bailey, to contract with Mailings Unlimited to conduct the informational mailing to all Town of Carroll property owners.

During discussion of the motion, Terry Penner suggested reformatting the letter by moving the paragraph announcing the Sep. 28th informational session from the end to the beginning. John Trammell asked if it was worthwhile to include existing building energy and maintenance costs and the potential savings for new facilities. Imre Szauter and Allan Clark agreed that while past expenditures were available, it is too early to accurately predict potential future savings. David Scalley asked from which account the mailing cost would be deducted – the Building Committee miscellaneous account (funded at $2,500) or the warrant article account (funded at $60,000). Imre Szauter suggested using the miscellaneous account, not the warrant article account. David Scalley confirmed that would be his choice as well.

After closing the discussion, the vote on the motion was unanimous in favor of contracting with Mailings Unlimited and using the miscellaneous account as the funding source.

Committee members discussed when the mailing should hit property owners’ mailboxes. The consensus was that Sep. 18th, ten days before the informational session, would be ideal.

Terry Penner asked about distributing the final letter electronically to Bretton Woods homeowner associations. Imre Szauter agreed to provide Terry Penner an electronic version once all the changes had been finalized.

Rena Vecchio suggested providing the letter to the Bretton Woods business community, specifically the Omni Mount Washington management, so they would be informed as well. David Scalley indicated he had a contact at the hotel; he will provide the contact’s information to Imre Szauter.

Under other issues, Imre Szauter provided an update on Committee account balances. The miscellaneous expenses account has $1,948 (out of $2,500 authorized) and the warrant article account has $52,988 (out of $60,000 authorized).

Imre Szauter summarized current action items:
1) Post approved August 17th Committee meeting minutes on the town website and Google Drive (Imre Szauter)
2) Finalize information session letter for mailing to all property owners (Imre Szauter)
3) Contract with Mailings Unlimited to print and mail informational session letter (Imre Szauter)
4) Reschedule hydrant pressure and flow testing with EJP, Inc. (Greg Hogan)

There were no additional action items identified.

Imre Szauter polled individual Committee members and guests for closing comments. Allan Clark commented that the process seems to be working and he was encouraged by the turnout and participation at the meeting. Wayne Garneau suggested that a handout at the informational session would assist with understanding the deficiencies and problems with the current municipal buildings. Imre Szauter mentioned that Allan Clark’s proposed existing building analysis would highlight the issues with the leased police department building, the fire department building, and the Town Hall and would be available for the Sep. 28th informational session. Allan Clark stated that to be a worthwhile handout, the document will be limited to one page per building.

The next regular meeting of the Committee was scheduled for Thursday, September 14th at 9:00 a.m. in Town Hall.

John Gardiner made a motion, seconded by John Trammell, to adjourn the meeting. The vote to adjourn was unanimous.

The meeting adjourned at 10:59 a.m.

Minutes prepared by Imre Szauter.

Town of Carroll, New Hampshire ®2024