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Minutes of 5/17/2010

May 23rd, 2010

Carroll Board of Selectmen
Meeting Minutes
May 17, 2010

"These minutes of the Town of Carroll Select Board have been recorded by its Secretary. Though believed to be accurate and correct they are subject to additions, deletions and corrections by the Select Board at its next meeting when the Board votes its final approval of the minutes. They are being made available at this time to conform to the requirements of New Hampshire RSA 91-A:2."

Minutes recorded by Maryclare H. Quigley

Board members present: Chris Hancock, Bonnie Moroney and Mark Catalano.

The meeting was called to order at 7:00 PM by Chairman Hancock

Members of the public present: Roberta McGee, Linda Dowling, Ike Ikasalo, Frank Maturo, Herb McGee, Mike Gooden, Chuck Jellison, Tom Gately, Bill Smalley, Tadd Bailey, Scott Sonia, Joan Karpf, Evan Karpf, Ben Jellison, Steve LaFrance, Kathy Donegan

Pledge of Allegiance

Chairman Hancock read the following statement: “This meeting is being taped by a private citizen. It is not done under the auspices of the town and is not an official record of the town.”

The board announced the approval of bills and signing of checks.

Chairman Hancock made a Motion to: Accept the minutes for May 3, 2010, as written. Selectman Moroney seconded and the Motion was approved. Selectman Catalano abstained as he was absent from the meeting. Next, Selectman Moroney made a Motion to: Accept the minutes for May 10, 2010, as written. The Motion was approved with Chairman Hancock abstaining as he was absent from that meeting.

Steve LaFrance from Horizons Engineering gave a summary of their work and findings (copy attached) on what they believe are the two issues of Old Town Road. He stated they had researched old files, plans and deeds including going to the library at Dartmouth College. Based on all of this, it is the opinion of Horizons Engineering that the road with its right-of-way, the first issue, is four rods wide – versus the nine feet width that is referenced by Mr. Gadbois. Mr. LaFrance noted that a rod is 16.5 feet wide, thus 33 feet from the center of the road represents the right-of-way.

Regarding the second piece, Mr. LaFrance said they have not seen any evidence that the Town did not have the right to put in the culvert. He added that Town Counsel also believed they had the right to put the culvert in, though it can get complicated. It was also noted that some of the work done to relocate the ditch appears to have been outside the right-of-way. Reference was made to the fact that Mr. Gadbois wants the culvert removed and the ditch put back the way it was. Mr. LaFrance opined that differences between the Town and Mr. Gadbois need to be set aside – he believes both should be left to provide adequate hydraulic relief. Removing one or the other places great strain on the road. Mr. LaFrance said based on the evidence, work was done on the Gadbois property without permission, and we need to go to the DES for an after-the-fact permit. He further stated that if getting an agreement with Mr. Gadbois to keep the ditch but to remove the culvert would keep this out of court, he could go with it. But he re-emphasized that while both should really stay, if only one can, then it has to be the ditch. Mr. LaFrance suggested that Attorney Whitelaw should be asked to approach Mr. Gadbois as noted to try to come to agreement. He reiterated if a compromise must be made, it should be to remove the culvert as Mr. Gadbois must agree to leave the ditch.

Further discussion took place regarding the history between the Town and Mr. Gadbois and it was stated work should have been done many years ago due to the flooding that has taken place several times, but it couldn’t be, and losing the road is a major concern. When asked, it was stated that there are four houses/camps further up the road that would be affected.

Discussion then took place as to whether the road is a Class V or Class VI – it is well-known that municipal funds cannot be spent on roads with a Class VI or higher distinction. It was noted that so far, no warrant article has been found to show that the Town has discontinued the road and Mr. LaFrance believes there is a preponderance of evidence that it is not a Class VI road. It was stated that there was an agreement between Mr. Gadbois and the Select Board many years ago that the part that goes by Mr. Gadbois’ house is Class VI, and it should be looked at. (This was in reference to when Mr. Gadbois extended his house with a deck or patio which was built in the setbacks, and his solution was to move the road at that point.) The legality of that agreement is in question, as it was pointed out that the Selectmen cannot sign off on things – they must be voted on by the Town. Mr. LaFrance read the short part from the agreement that said where the road passes the house it is a Class VI road and said the Selectmen had signed it, regardless of the legality of their doing so. In spite of all, Mr. LaFrance said he could not make a statement on the class of the road without further, additional research of town records.

Jenn Hancock, Chairman of the Recreation Committee was unable to attend, but one of her items was to advise the Select Board of their last two hires for the summer program – Cody Leonard as a fulltime counselor and Ben Brodeur, a part time sub who would be working three days. Selectman Catalano said the Committee had been considering limiting attendance to the program to only people who owned property in town. Select Board Chairman Hancock said there had been discussion at some of the meetings about doing that because of costs of employees versus attendees, but it had not been adopted – they chose instead to accept the number of children into the program based on the number of employees they hired.

The Driveway Permit on Maple Drive for Mr. Dewhurst came next. Inasmuch as it is believed that this is not a town road, the requirement for this was questioned, even though all roads are given names for emergency 911 purposes. It was noted that Mr. Dewhurst has a Building Permit, which will suffice for getting a physical (911) address, so it was decided the Driveway Permit was unnecessary and therefore made void. The Secretary said she will have a refund check issued. This did bring forth discussion of the town’s responsibility to property owners on roads not maintained by the town. Joan Karpf said she had brought documents that she got from LGC that the town might wish to consider having those owners sign. In any case, it was felt there should be a notice of the town’s limited responsibilities for these roads and that it should be recorded at the Registry of Deeds. This will be looked into.


The following items were approved and signed.

Certificate of Occupancy – Brennan
Water Warrant – Cote, Oleson

When the Intent to Excavate came up, Selectman Moroney said this is regarding the subdivision that Bill Rines is doing, and the Board had been in contact with Laura Spector, the town’s attorney on the Planning Board case with Mr. Rines. Attorney Spector said it would be fine to sign the Intent, but they might wish to add a statement to it. Thus, Selectman Moroney made a Motion: To waive the attorney-client privilege with regard to an email from Laura Spector at 4:51 p.m., May 17, 2010. Chairman Hancock seconded and the Motion passed unanimously. Selectman Moroney read the statement, “This permit authorizes the excavation of dirt on Lot 10. It does not authorize the removal of any excavated materials from the sight, except in conjunction with an exempt highway excavation pursuant to RSA 155-E:2, IV, and is not an approval of excavation which has occurred on the property in the past, the legality of which the parties are presently litigating.” It was noted that this will be attached to the Intent.

Chuck Jellison spoke of the litigation already under way and about the very large numbers of truckloads of material being removed daily and wondered what the subdivision had to do with it. He said when this was first approved it was supposedly a limited project, and now, several years later they are still listening to the noise of trucks, excavators and rock crushers. He asked the Board to look at what is going on and see that it has nothing to do with the subdivision – he listens to it all day, every day. He said he has spent more time with town government, going from one board to another over this, in the last two years than he has since he moved into his house in 1973, and he is aggravated that it is still going on. Evan Karpf said material is leaving the site by private truckers that have nothing to do with DOT. He went on to say that this is what is considered to be “incidental excavation” and that has yet to be determined by the proper boards and there are boards in town for this and he believes if they sign this they will be going against the other boards in town. It is their intent to treat everyone the same and fairly. Discussion took place about RSA 155-E the state statute which regulates excavations. Mr. Jellison pointed out that he had seen state trucks among those leaving the site and Chairman Hancock added that he believed the municipal project in Franconia had been hired out to a private company, but could not speak to any more than that as he did not know. Ben Jellison said he had gotten some information from the office and then read the RSA 72-B and it states the assessing officers, Board of Selectmen, may decline to sign the Intent for several stated reasons – among them being compliance. He asked, for their own protection, if the Board knows for sure that it is compliant.

Joan Karpf said she believed they need to make sure that everyone understands this started out as an excavation project and no one knew when it started that it was going to be a subdivision. She went on to say if it’s determined that an incidental excavation is going on once it’s received approval, it does not need permits, but it does need to have the Intent to Excavate signed because the material is being sold so that’s why DRA is involved because a tax is placed on it. She questioned who determined that it is incidental as this is for the subdivision and she said initially it was an excavation and went on to discuss determinations. Chairman Hancock confirmed that Mr. Rines had received subdivision approval for three lots and that it was for Lot 10. He went on to say that he had gone on-line and found that there was an open-ended permit from DES. Mrs. Karpf said that while that is required, it does not cover the town and further said that when a subdivision is approved, it is with the understanding that the land is buildable, and an incidental excavation means material has to be moved in order to build. She said lot 10 is huge, and questioned if an incidental excavation permit is legitimate as a house could be built anywhere on the lot. She said the question is if it actually is incidental and neither the ZBA nor the Planning Board has been able to review it at all. Dr. Karpf advised the Select Board to let the proper board determine it and then act accordingly. After further discussion regarding the legality of the project, Selectman Catalano made a Motion to: Table the Intent to Excavate until they can understand if the current removal of material from the property is properly permitted. Chairman Hancock seconded and it passed unanimously. It was noted that if it is determined that it does not have proper permit we will be in contact with town counsel, Planning Board and ZBA.

Evan Karpf spoke to the Board about a request made to him for using the runway at the airport to test drive a car. The person built the car and wants to be sure it is functional before taking it into a race. He told the Board he had suggested this be done on a midweek day rather than a weekend day and that it will be after 9 a.m. He also said he had been told it would take about an hour. It was requested that it take place before May 30, when tourists will hopefully be starting to come to town. Dr. Karpf said he would be happy to make sure it is prior to May 30. Chairman Hancock mad a Motion: That the Board agrees that the runway may be used as stated, Selectman Moroney seconded, and the Motion passed unanimously.

As there was no further business, Chairman Hancock moved to go into Non-Public Session for Town Aid at 8:31 p.m. The Board was polled and went into Non-Public Session.

At the close of Non-Public Session, Chairman Hancock moved to return to Public Session and seal the minutes from Non-Public Session. Selectman Moroney seconded and the Motion passed unanimously.

There being no further business, Chairman Hancock made a motion to adjourn the meeting. Selectman Moroney seconded and the motion passed unanimously. Chairman Hancock declared the meeting ended at 8:52 p.m. The next meeting will be Monday, May 24, 2010.

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